1. Dueling at its finest

      written by Ray Benefield
      So you guys caught me. I did not post yesterday. My apologies. Guess no forge lesson this week. I'll put one out this weekend though. I'll probably make the frequency about once every two weeks now and just try to get used to writing every day. Just to get my writing skills together and get into the habit of things. One job I wouldn't mind doing at Bungie is being a Community Content Writer so in order to do that I need to get used to writing all the time. lol... Urk, I'm not after your job, but I would love to be a pupil. The problem is I have no professional writing experience. Anyways, today I want to talk about something that has really always interested me. The concept and theory behind a duel... the art of playing in a one versus one match has always fascinated me. And it has always been something that I have wanted to create in Halo.


      Armored Core Duels


      Armored Core has always been a game that focused on one on one matches. Sure you can play in team games or battle royals, but your skill in the community is judged on your one on one skill. Even in the old days, people would gather for local system linked tournaments to prove their superior piloting skills. Here is a nice video I just found from one of the old school style Armored Cores.


      After watching that video you can see how movement, and use of cover is a HUGE deal in dueling. Out maneuvering missiles and your opponent's shots is a big deal. Armored Core is based on an auto-lock system so it isn't a matter of accuracy like Halo or COD. It is a matter of dishing out more damage than you are taking. Learning to mitigate damage and increase the damage you are dealing is what will push you into victory. It is a damage push and shove match. You can definitely see that in the modern day AC games where speed is a huge factor. Range is also a huge deal depending on the weapons you use and being able to get to keep your optimal range can be the difference between life and death. The two players below are using two different rifles. The yellow one uses rifles that require constant pressure at close range in order to be effective, while the blue AC is focused on scoring single and harder hitting shots with a lot less ammo. Watch their life totals and see how advantage can switch based on how the players set up their encounters.


      For the first minute the blue AC stays at range and is able to wittle his opponent's AC down quite low. After the first minute the yellow AC starts to setup situations where he can stay on his opponent and constantly pelt him and an extremely close range. As soon as he switches up his strategy he ties up the game and eventually wins with 6K left. This kind of switch in strategy may not be apparent to the untrained eye, but when in their shows different scenarios are constantly running through each player's head trying to outwit the other and set up an optimal situation for their particular mech's style. For Armored Core there is a lot that can go into playing on the battlefield, but just as much attention to detail is made in the garage when building your AC.


      Recreating this experience


      So I've always wanted to create this dueling gameplay in Halo. With reach's armor abilities we now have the ability to add to a player's style that involves more than just what weapons he has. Also with Loadouts a player can pick a weapon based on his style. Halo has the benefit of also having a round system so you don't have to constantly restart the game. So obviously I want one life with a lot of damage resistance(health). So the gametype can be played on any map I want to increase the speed so you don't have to worry about long walks to encounters. I want to give options to players with loadouts and different armor abilities as well. Here are the possible loadouts that I am considering right now:


      • Sprint/DMR
      • Evade/Shotgun
      • Drop Shield/Concussion Rifle
      • Armor Lock/Grenade Launcher
      • Jetpack/Assault Rifle
      I was originally going to try secondary weapons, but balancing those will be tough to make sure every class has a reason to use both weapons. And I'm not sure about grenades quite yet. Also I was thinking of a much higher jump height and high gravity to allow quick access to more vertical areas. I'm using Asylum as my basis. I want you to be able to hit the top level in one jump without loosing any momentum. So what do you guys think? I've tried something like this and it was quite fun with just Evade and a DMR. lol...

      22 comments:

      Gnappy said...

      Sounds pretty sweet. How are you handling Melees?

      Nikatorus said...

      This sounds interesting. Do you plan on playing on specialized maps, or just normal ones?

      GodlyPerfection said...

      Well I made a prototype a little bit ago and tested Swords as secondary, but because of their lunge and damage they were WAY too powerful. So I may have melee actually do a decent amount of damage. The prototype only really included evade so melee wasn't that bad if you didn't have a sword. However with Sprint melee might be overpowered, who knows.

      Wolfpack said...

      I disagree with drop shield unless you explain how it is armored core like. A possible reason for use of secondary weapons would be no weapon pickups since you can't get more weapons on AC. Increase damage for melee to simulate the swords.
      I'd like to debate each aspect with you if that's okay with you :D

      Wolfpack said...

      Okay so I have a bit more time now. Jet pack is more effective in lower gravity so I assume it will be useless in this game type. Assuming you are doing the upped jump and grav up which I think is a good idea due to the fact we can't equip everyone with a boosting system without taking away from freedom of style. I think the maps should be a bit bigger and hologram should be introduced to act much like the flare in AC.

      Armor lock seems like it may be ineffective in such a gametype because it requires people to be close or have a teammate back you up while you take the damage. If this is 1v1 game then no AL.

      I approve of sprint, evade, hologram, and maybe drop shield. I'm resilient against it for a few reasons. As for invisibility... I'm up for a debate on both of these

      Dj7291993 said...

      It sounds good except for the jetpack. I don't think that the AR is the best choice, relative to the other weapons. I think that the needler would be better. But that is just my opinion, and I haven't had the chance to pick up AC yet, so I don't know if that had anything to do with your choice. My only other concern is, with these weapons, I don't think the drop shield would be effective in a duel. The reason is that, aside from the dmr, the range on all the other weapons isn't very good (unless you are good at the nade arcing). Also, with increased speed, since the drop shield is stationary, would it end up just slowing it's user down? Also, you might need to disable assassinations, but I'm sure you've run through that.

      Maximo Vara said...

      Also disable headshots

      Kirov 099 said...

      Awesome. You might have convinced me to buy AC. At first I thought the shotgun evade combo would be extremely powerful, but then you mentioned how low you want the gravity. If its that low, it should be fine.

      Wolfpack said...

      He actually wants gravity higher. Jump height will be increased meaning they can just jump higher but will hit the ground in the same amount of time as you normally would. I considered the overpowered nature ofthe shotty but the upped resistance should allow the other to survive for awhile. Plus, if you see the shotgun then you know to not let your opponent close or else lol. It would require the patience and skill I believe godly wants to go for.

      Snooziedoes said...

      Drop shield wouldn't work, cause it recharges health and protects you. Shotgun, Concussion, and Grenade Launcher are pretty much useless if people has high jump or uses jetpack. DMR and AR are best choises, as AR class beats everything except DMR.

      Wolfpack said...

      I agree that AR is good and I like your argument against dropshield. The shotty is actually not bad because you can argue the same about dmrs. At close range drm would be useless as well because they just jump outta your vision.

      GodlyPerfection said...

      Where did my reply go? Anyways, Drop Shield will work because there will be no health recharge which means it just acts as a bubble shield. Also I said that headshots will be disabled. And people do have high jump. Concussion Rifle and Grenade Launcher are much more powerful than you give them credit.

      Also I said wolfpack that this is not supposed to emulate Armored core at all. It is just supposed to remake the gameplay dueling style. And the only combo I'm worried about is the shotgun, but I don't think it will be too bad considering the jump height will be a great counter to get out of shottie range easily. What about switching AR to Armor Lock and Grenade Launcher to Jet Pack?

      Curtis Smith said...

      This sounds like an interesting idea. But In AC the movement seems to be a lot different than in Halo. There has to be a way to get people interested in stead of the stereo type of "I'll 1v1 you, you noob!".

      Other wise it would be interesting. I've seen in Halo3 a map/game type where every one spawns in a box and watches as random people duel 1v1 in an arena. I'm working on a game like it, but still it's not quite the same as what your saying.

      Good luck and let me know how it goes.

      RodziR said...

      oh the memories. I'm lookin forward to this so I can challenge snoozie. I don't either like AL on this 'cause it would just slow down gameplay. I see lot more potential in dodgeing than spamming invincibility button every time something is about to hit you

      Snooziedoes said...

      AR to Armor Lock and Grenade Launcher to Jet Pack sounds better, but I really have to play this before being sure.

      Wolfpack said...

      Almighty Godly. Lol I have a beta gametype of this now if you wanna check it out. Afterall it was your idea so only fitting you be a part of it. I've tested things out quite a bit on an alpha version and I think you'll like the result. Let me know tomorrow if you wanna check it out or if you'd rather make it on your own. Either way its your idea so you get the credit.

      GodlyPerfection said...

      I responded to your post in the forums about it wolfpack. Go there to discuss. :P

      III s3 III said...

      Finally! My first post!

      I love Duels!

      Just by the first look, I think your loudout-options are not very well balanced.
      For example:
      - Drop Shield isn´t very useful ( = too weak) when there are no grenades.
      - Concussion Rifle is most powerful as a defensive weapon, against enemy groups and (of course) vehicles. Not the average 1v1 weapon. + low gravity? Bad idea!
      - With Grenade Launcher it can be tough to finish someone off. So, without a side-weapon, you only make ´em no-shield before you have to reload and basically have to start all over again.
      - Evade/Shotgun is much too superior.

      The "easy" solution would actually be to add a secondary weapon.

      Also, competitive-minded players do not like changes to jump-heights and damage-resistance, with a few exceptions like MLG.

      To be honest: I think you should consider making a 1v1 MAP instead of a gametype!
      Ermm... is it the wrong place to advertise my own 1v1 map?
      http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Reach/FileSets.aspx?player=III%20s3%20III

      WolfpackDragon said...

      Hey ||| s3 ||| I actually took over this little idea of godly's and I'm glad to hear your feed back. Just about every issue you have brought up has in fact been adressed already. This was just a basis of what godly wanted for this gametype so it wasn't really meant to be completely balanced, rather to get the idea out there and and started. If you go to the forums on this site and go to member portfolios, you'll find that I have posted an updated version of this game. Feel free to comment on there with any additional concerns. As for your map I'll check it out later and see if it's ideal for the settings I have. I'm actually tring to find more maps that fit this gametype.

      Captainppineapple44 said...

      I drew up a gametype along these guidelines and the dropshield did fine. It was good at blocking cuncusion rifle blasts

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